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Mr Cat
ParticipantAlright, I’ll give it to you in a formal, structured way.
Premise 1: Based on what we know about human nature in general, if a man old enough to be a girl’s father or grandfather had access to her while she was still a child, this would almost certainly not pass without leaving negative effects on her, in the long run if not in the short term.
Premise 2: Human nature is generally the same for us and for Muhammad’s people.
Conclusion: A marriage between a girl Aisha’s age and a man Muhammad’s age would be harmful even in Muhammad’s time.
You’d have to be stubborn to dispute Premise 1 or Premise 2.
Mr Cat
ParticipantSo you concluded that makes it normal? Are you talking about a literal child, or about a teenager with some femininity?
Pedophilia in the medical sense refers to prepubescent children. Adolescents or those between childhood and adolescence have other terms.
Anyway, the same justifications could be applied in Sparta. The boy there wasn’t forced into homosexuality; these were intimate relationships that were common and supposedly strengthened the bond between teacher and student.So would you say it wouldn’t harm the boy, not even in the long run? No direct or indirect harm?
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This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by
Mr Cat.
Mr Cat
ParticipantThe same way you don’t know about the boy in similar conditions.
I think you assume human nature is very fluid and everything depends on society, so you don’t see that there’s a fixed “core.”
If you admitted there’s a fixed element, you’d expect that what harms a girl today would also harm her back then, despite cultural differences, because human nature is the same.Mr Cat
ParticipantWhat’s your evidence that consensual homosexuality with a boy in a society that accepts it is harmful?
You’d say, based on what we know about human nature in general, we can be almost certain it would negatively affect the boy, even if not immediately then in his psychological development.
That’s an inferential argument based on general human nature, not on direct observation.
Mr Cat
ParticipantThe harm to the young girl. Okay, a question. When Spartan society allowed teachers to have sex with boys and considered it good, would you also say that’s acceptable because societies differ?
And what’s the difference between that and Aisha’s case?-
This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by
Mr Cat.
Mr Cat
ParticipantSo you mean it’s just a custom or terminology, without any real underlying reasons?
Mr Cat
ParticipantWould I have an objection to a man in his fifties today courting a nine-year-old girl and having sex with her?
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This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by
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